The Argument
Oct. 20th, 2002 09:18 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
changelingI'm confused as to the kerfuffle that the Nazi!Riddle fic of so long ago caused in the HP fandom. Isn't eugenics precisely what Riddle follows in his obsession with purebloodedness?
This person was highly offended, and compared Nazi!Riddle fic with a hypothetical fiction in which Draco was a follower of bin Laden (or, as she spelt it, "bin Lauden"). For one thing, although bin Laden has become the 21st Century's villain's villain, he has very little in common with Hitler in terms of aims. Bin Laden hates America for the bombing etcetera, Hitler tried to reunite Germany so it was a master race and massacred millions of people; not only Jews, but homosexuals, Romany and political dissidents. And I'm sorry, but bin Laden is a pre-schooler when it comes to causing terror and fear in generations. September 11 does not match up to the Holocaust by any means. Perhaps in years to come we will be able to compare him to Hitler in terms of wastage of human life, but I truly hope that does not come to pass.
I understand if you find the topic of Nazism so repulsive that you don't want to read it, but I read the fic and enjoyed it. I love pieces that challenge me, that show moral shading; not only black and white but grey as well. No one is purely evil or purely good: Hitler, for example, was a vegetarian.
At no stage was![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
marvolo or company Nazi apologists; if anything, the Nazi!fic gives some depth to Riddle's "evil" beyond the merely cartoonish two-dimensional evil we've viewed so far in canon.
How can you not draw parallels between the Voldemort reign and Hitler's reign in Germany when JK herself puts the defeat of the Dark Wizard Grindlewald in 1945? Isn't it fascinating to look at things in a wider perspective and realise that as these characters are growing up they are being influenced by the world around them? Riddle's status on purebloodedness only looks shocking from a 20th century viewpoint; those sort of arguments were being levelled against "half-castes" (half Aboriginal, half "white") and so forth in Australia in the 19th century and probably later. The English have been guilty of that sort of obsession with purity since time immemorial. Early British and Celtic histories were essentially stock books, naming all the illustrious forebears and what great works they did.
By no means am I claiming what the Nazis did was right; one of the things that is scariest about them is that you could find yourself agreeing with them. I remember one of the scariest passages I ever read when younger was in a Robert Ludlum book that had NeoNazis as "baddies". There was a speech given by the leader of the party, and I started to fall under the spell of the writing and agree with him. That was one of the scariest moments of my life. Hitler was by all accounts a very charismatic speaker (although I have watched a video of one of his speeches and I think it must lose a lot in the translation); exactly the sort of person who a young Tom Riddle would aspire to.
There's lots of other people's opinions on this matter. Here, and
here.
I think I understand wherekissaki is coming from though. While I can stomach a thoughtful, well-written fic from the likes of people like moritari or even if cairnsy was to write one, I dread to think what the little fandom monkeys might write. (Maybe a song fic, using the songs from the early career of 5ive!)
I think I've said my piece.
This person was highly offended, and compared Nazi!Riddle fic with a hypothetical fiction in which Draco was a follower of bin Laden (or, as she spelt it, "bin Lauden"). For one thing, although bin Laden has become the 21st Century's villain's villain, he has very little in common with Hitler in terms of aims. Bin Laden hates America for the bombing etcetera, Hitler tried to reunite Germany so it was a master race and massacred millions of people; not only Jews, but homosexuals, Romany and political dissidents. And I'm sorry, but bin Laden is a pre-schooler when it comes to causing terror and fear in generations. September 11 does not match up to the Holocaust by any means. Perhaps in years to come we will be able to compare him to Hitler in terms of wastage of human life, but I truly hope that does not come to pass.
I understand if you find the topic of Nazism so repulsive that you don't want to read it, but I read the fic and enjoyed it. I love pieces that challenge me, that show moral shading; not only black and white but grey as well. No one is purely evil or purely good: Hitler, for example, was a vegetarian.
At no stage was
marvolo or company Nazi apologists; if anything, the Nazi!fic gives some depth to Riddle's "evil" beyond the merely cartoonish two-dimensional evil we've viewed so far in canon.How can you not draw parallels between the Voldemort reign and Hitler's reign in Germany when JK herself puts the defeat of the Dark Wizard Grindlewald in 1945? Isn't it fascinating to look at things in a wider perspective and realise that as these characters are growing up they are being influenced by the world around them? Riddle's status on purebloodedness only looks shocking from a 20th century viewpoint; those sort of arguments were being levelled against "half-castes" (half Aboriginal, half "white") and so forth in Australia in the 19th century and probably later. The English have been guilty of that sort of obsession with purity since time immemorial. Early British and Celtic histories were essentially stock books, naming all the illustrious forebears and what great works they did.
By no means am I claiming what the Nazis did was right; one of the things that is scariest about them is that you could find yourself agreeing with them. I remember one of the scariest passages I ever read when younger was in a Robert Ludlum book that had NeoNazis as "baddies". There was a speech given by the leader of the party, and I started to fall under the spell of the writing and agree with him. That was one of the scariest moments of my life. Hitler was by all accounts a very charismatic speaker (although I have watched a video of one of his speeches and I think it must lose a lot in the translation); exactly the sort of person who a young Tom Riddle would aspire to.
There's lots of other people's opinions on this matter. Here, and
here.
I think I understand where
kissaki is coming from though. While I can stomach a thoughtful, well-written fic from the likes of people like moritari or even if cairnsy was to write one, I dread to think what the little fandom monkeys might write. (Maybe a song fic, using the songs from the early career of 5ive!)I think I've said my piece.
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
no subject
Date: 2002-10-20 04:39 am (UTC)Two big arse posts in two days. I'm impressed. Hoping you've also done your essays, but that's probably hoping a bit much.
*hugs and kisses* Did you have fun shopping today?
no subject
Date: 2002-10-20 06:39 am (UTC)I've done some work on my essays... just not much. :(
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Date: 2002-10-20 04:42 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2002-10-20 06:28 am (UTC)http://www.livejournal.com/talkpost.bml?journal=dracosexysexy&itemid=840
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Date: 2002-10-20 10:30 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2002-10-20 11:44 am (UTC)